Edit 2: I wrote this about two weeks ago after coming to slow life from 10 days of insane social stimulation a.k.a hanging out with my best friends for 10 days straight doing nothing but drinking, partying and eating. I did some meditation, relaxed, hung out with some of my college buddies and thought about this for a bit. I've decided to put this issue on standby-kind of. In other words, I will talk to people, mess around, and go out whenever I can etc., but I won't make a big deal of it or think about it to much. When I wrote this post I was caring too much about this issue, to the point where it was distracting me from my larger goals as well as keeping me inside my head while socializing. I want to focus my time and energy on the goal I want to achieve such as learning languages, becoming part of a startup, learning marketing and business development, travelling, and becoming more informed about the world around me; and, subsequently meet people through those avenues. To this, I am getting involved in organizations, meetups and groups relevant to these goals and meeting people there.
(Edit 3 : I have realized this isn't truly what I want my dream world to be like , but rather the world I made myself believe others were living in that I thought I would like. Socializing requires time and patience and can be a form of infinite distraction ( I know people who would literally spend hours socializing via every possible avenue including facebook, skype, messaging and real life to the point that a whole summer would go by and nothing productive was achieved). I also I realize that I can't expect to click with everyone, and personally I rather be polarizing and connect with those who I am most likely to get along with and repel those who I am not likely to get along with. Overall, I rather just relax, get involved in my work/passions and seek people in those respective fields so that I can be infinitely more productive and knowledgeable. From there I can branch out and meet people from other walk's of life through six degrees of separation.
Currently I'm a 20 year old in college. I haven't gotten laid, or even kissed a girl sober. For the majority of my life I haven't cared. Like I truly, to my core, haven't given a flying fuck. Normally I just hang out with my friends, played some video games (I have since quit) watch movies, write on my blog, read books, and do stuff like learn German, Programming, or how to start a passive business as well as the occasional party here and there
Anyways: I turned 20 this year and it hit me insanely hard, First just how much time I was wasting video games, and how even 5 minutes reading a book is more productive than the 100+ hrs I've spent video gaming (which is why I quit) . But the thing that hit me most was two things 1. How little experience I have with women, and 2. How little new people I've actually met on campus. My best friends are still my friends from highschool, by a long shot. These are the guys I can make fun, push around, say stupid shit, and I know they will still love me no matter what. I haven't made that many friends of that kind here in college, albeit I have made a few.
So the first thing I asked myself was: Is this really important? I mean I had been going for a solid year already just minding my own business, doing my own thing. Not really making that many friends, and less girlfriends to boot. But at the same time I don't really care. I want a freedom business, I want to be able to travel on a whim. I know that when I travel being able to be like able will be incredibly important, and thus I know that socializing will be incredibly important in the long run.
As for women, some of my friends have even called me asexual due to my complete indifference the past 20 years. I just frankly didn't care much, the majority of girls seemed capricious, dumb, and misguided. Not only that, my standards are high (physically) so hitting on girls out at parties has been intimidating (edit: this is an excuse, I have since made it my goal to talk to every girl regardless of how attractive she is, in fact the more attractive the better). This year I've had a cute girl play back and forth text messaging with me, but other than her constant condescending flirting, I don't think she's into me ( I've given hints to hang out countless time, all have been rejected or deflected as I like to say) and know that thinking about one girl for too long can be a death sentence. (Edit: I messed up with this girl and I know why. 1. I wasn't sexual enough early on 2. I misjudged her . 3. I was way to clowny/crazy around her, which I realized actually came off kind of creepy 4. I texted her too much instead of just hanging out in real life . Next time I go for a girl who isn't a party person, I'll try to keep texting on the low side until a couple of meet-ups in real life. Real life interactions>all.)
I most likely plan to stay in college the next 2 years ( I'm on a full scholarship so its not a big issue to me, at least finance wise) unless I hit jackpot with one of my freedom businesses. Honestly, it is extremely easy for me to just not care about this, and sometimes I really just don't want to. I rather just hangout in my close social circle and dabble in my own things, but at the same time I know I should just go all out and get my social skills to a new level, especially while at college. Currently I have made a conscious effort to just be around more people. If i see someone walking alone to class I open up a conversation, I try talk to people on facebook so that they are reminded of me.
In my dream world I would obviously love to just have this shit handled, and have my life be exceptional socially.
So I guess my question to the community is: What do you think about socializing and women (or men)? how important would you rate getting this shit handled is and why? What were the main motivations you guys had to get this shit handled, and if you succeeded to some extent, how?
Edit: I think people have a misconception thinking I'm anti-social hermit mode. I have friends in college. I love my roommates, I love most of the guy friends I have. We go out to parties and the like. its mostly the women aspect of socializing and the finding people to whom I can completely express myself to that is hard.
Hey it's me again - all of the other people's responses thus far have reminded me of a very important point. Advanced apologies if this is made out to sound shallow but...
You - in College at the moment (on a full scholarship no less!!!) - are currently experiencing something very unique and special. Unless you go into pickup or flip into an extrovert later in life college will be one of the only times in life that beautiful women are literally HANDED to you on a platter - day in and day out - every second every minute. Compared to being out of college for near a decade now it is just absurd how easy you have it at your point in time. Make the most of it!
You like video games? You're in the bonus stage right now. Life doesn't have many bonus stages so you gotta utilize each one to the max. I can't really think of a situation which will ever mirror college ever again in terms of availability and selection of women. Don't be like me - who came out of a pipe into a bonus stage - and in my naivete made a mad dash for the exit pipe while only grabbing 2 or 3 coins out of hundreds on the way out.
In college you will be put into classes and contexts and social groups with people vastly different from you but all having something underlying in common - being in college. Thus women will have their guard down and you have a much more open receptiveness to them if you make a move as opposed to cold picking up someone on the street or at a bar/etc... Since you are forcibly mixed with all sorts of people your selection of possible women to select from is absurd. Outside of college people usually network by association or employment - thus you will tend to receive more of the same (as people network by similarities) and will never really get to experience 'the other side' like in college. A budding cheerleader, journalism major, world traveler, lawyer, computer hack, business entrepreneur, botanist, physicist, teacher all in the same room? Unheard of!
You want motivation? If the lure of successes are too abstract for you to grasp maybe a look at what awaits you if you fail is in order! http://3rddimension.wordpress.com/2009/08/13/early-college-was-weird-dreams-weirder/ The world works on the principles on polarity and duality - meaning - if you don't know what you want - you can start by knowing what you don't want. Instead of building the vision from pieces you can start with a solid mass and chisel out the portions you don't want until what you want is left. You end up with the same thing in the end.
What will it be Andrew? It is your life in the end and everything you have done and will do you eventually need to take ownership for.
Thanks for the reply man, I really appreciate it. Yeah I do get defensive and cynical, I'm usually not this way, It's just I really have gotten frustrated after noticing how weak my game is. I think most of it comes from the fact I honestly don't know what to do and how far away this seems from my reality. It hurts to admit it since I've been stuck living life a certain way for so long, but I know I must take action if I want change. I already say Hi to just about everyone I meet and try to go to more parties, I just think its a matter of extrapolating that to woman.
If you're in a metro area, there's probably a pickup lair where you can meet some other guys. In the long term, I don't recommend people hang out at a lair but it can be a good way to challenge your limiting beliefs in the beginning. Or you could always hire a coach if you got that kind of money.
Start small, reward your successes, expect failures, and keep moving once you've recovered. Find others to help keep pushing you when you don't wanna continue. Having a buddy when you're trying to learn anything is huge, but not necessary if you can't find one immediately.
I'm actually married, only 23 years old, though. I can't offer much advice on finding women, but I do know this; I didn't look for my wife nor she look for me; we actually shared a mutual friend who introduced us. I had no idea who she was as I had never met her in my life, but we lived within 2 miles of each other. We have been together since I was 19, she was 17. Yeah, we got married kind of quick at 2.5 years in, but it seems to be working thus far.
Random question: Am I using my semicolons correctly above?
What makes you think that if you don't learn social skills now you'll magically learn them when you get out in the real world and start traveling? If you're a shy person at home, you're going to be shy person in bum-fuck Egypt also. Girls are not just going to throw themselves at you in foreign country cause you're an American (I assume or from whatever first world country) not quality ones anyways. Not everyone is going to be your best friend, but its cool to have social skills to at least make valuable acquaintances along the way. Don't be so quick to judge a woman either, give them a chance and talk to them. That stupid looking blond you think is beneath you might actually be a person of deep quality. Also, think, who the fuck are you to think you're too good? Think about what you bring to the table. Are you just a fat or scrawny kid who talks the talks, but doesn't walk the walk? Or do you actually have something to offer a girl? Ambitions, travel, enlightening conversation. How about instead of focusing on what other lack, you focus on what you lack, get to work and fix it.
Definitely some good advice here; I'd also like to chime in with my 2 cents =)
If you have barriers to socializing with women, by default, you're shutting out approximately 50% of the world's population.
I think the key here is to drop any expectations of what you wish to happen, in any encounter. Don't become fixated on any one particular girl to satisfy your needs — you are capable of meeting all of your own needs. When girls realize that you're not that creepy guy who just wants to get into their pants, they will feel more comfortable opening up and sharing with you, whether that be friendship or sexually. We all have sexual needs, but they aren't dependent on any one person; those needs can be satisfied a multitude of ways.
Also, like you mentioned in your text message encounter with that one particular girl, you think you texted her too much and she "deflected". This is probably a very accurate assumption. I find that with girls, less is more — let them wonder, be curious...the more mysterious you are, the more they want to figure you out. If they can read you like a book and predict the outcome like a boilerplate hollywood flick, then there typically is no passion or excitement. You don't want to be the guy who chases the girls, you want the girls to chase you; that's what being confident and an "alpha male" is all about. It's not as easy to sum up as "Nice guys finish last", but there is definately a ring of truth to that; don't cater to their every whim and do what they want, but also don't be a complete jerk and asshole either. Just be confident in who you are, and exude that in your every day encounters (whether it be with a girl or a guy).
But, realize that girls are human beings just like you are, they just perceive things in their own unique way. At first, it seems so complicated because of all these different techniques and pickup lines and female psychology, but really, it's simple — you're just connecting with another human being. Just like speaking with somebody who is not a native english speaker, you want to speak in terms that they understand; this is the key to effective communication (to put it in terms that the other will understand).
You don't have any problems connecting with your guy friends, and it really doesn't need to be any different for girls. Just try making friends with girls, no sexual pressure there — and if you have female friends, they will often introduce you to their friends, or even try to play matchmaker. Some of the best contacts come through your network of people you already know :) You can also try to practice interacting with girls who aren't judged as very attractive; they probably won't have their shields up, and you will get some good practice! Just be honest, and don't mislead others while practicing, because while you can gain experience, I find it is always the best policy to treat others like you would like to be treated. Also, if you make good friends with a girl, ask her for advice and I would be willing to bet she would be glad to help (though, realize that the advice will be coming through a female perspective).
If you'd like to understand more, you can study pickup, but realize that pickup techniques and philosophy just educate you primarily on your own psychology, and the psychology of women. Like Zen, once you "truly" understand pickup, you leave it behind; pickup is just another lens of understanding the world around us.
Try, try, and try again, if you fall then get up and try again — fail your way to success!
your advice is the one that most resonates with what I have come to believe after approaching this subject with a clear mind. When I wrote this my mind was kind of hazy, and I just needed some solid advice to get me back on track, which it did. I have come to realize what went wrong with said girl, but that is way behind me now. In fact now that you mention it I think girls are much more attracted to you when you are just spontaneous and sort of in your own world, not trying to impress or be impressed. Which kind of explains why some of my friends say X girl is into me when in fact I don't even notice cause I'm just kind of doing my own thing and I am oblivious to it.
You pretty much summed what i said in my edits, I'm going to focus on my life and meeting people through my avenues, and then try and meet girls when I'm out at parties/relaxing and not in a hurry. I don't want to make girls, sex, or socializing a priority in my life but rather a part of my life, both because they can end up distracting me from what I really want to achieve and do, and second because by thinking about these things, you actually become worse at them, because the best socializes/ lovers are those who can relax and let go.
The best adivce is "Just be confident in who you are, and exude that in your every day encounters (whether it be with a girl or a guy)" Be who you are, develop your own set of ethics and principles, and live by them. Occasionally revisit them, question them, but never be without a strong set or principles and beliefs. Then when you share your thoughts, humor, and ideas with other, you will be coming from an angle that is truly yours, and thus will be polarizing, attracting those who you are most likely to get along with and repelling those who you might not. Of course this is never forces or out of malice, but rather just the natural way of who you mix and can relate with and who you can. Trying to please everyone is a recipe for disaster.
Trying to get layed on every social occasion is a ineffective strategy. Spending time on facebook for the sole purpose on maintaining relationship is ineffective.
On the other hand deliberate practice is useful for increasing social skills. Saying "Hi" to every stranger you cross on the street doesn't take much time. If it's however out of your comfort zone as it is for most people, it helps you to grow your social skills.
There are other exercise like going out and asking 30 girl on a single day for the time that also can be worthwhile when you have low social skills.
When it comes to actually deepening relationships, be yourself. When it comes to training your abilities, from time to time move outside your comfort zone.
Okay, I'm no further along the path of life than you are, but I travel more often and make more new friends/girlfriends. I also get laid on occasion (a new girl about once every 5 months).
And the goal I'm pursuing is much like your own. A roaring social life, a great romantic life, and an automated income.
The route I'm taking is built around focus. Instead of trying to get it all right now, I'm planning on getting it all by the end of 5 years (4 now, I've been in this for a year already).
So, the first step is a freedom business. Make $3500/month automated, so I can focus on other goals and have my money situation handled. Aka, I'm building runway, that will eventually build itself and need little maintenance.
That means that, even though I want more friends and more girls, I'm not focused on that right now.
I'm focused on one thing: building an automated income.
When I have that handled, I'll move my focus to more travel. Then, girls.
And then...With my money, time, freedom, and romance handled; who knows what I'll pursue next?
So, my advice to you is this:
Focus on one thing right now. Just one.
Set a clear, big goal, and get it handled in the next year or so.
Then move onto the next.
Focus on what? For you, I recommend focus on social skills. You're in university, and that is one of the best social environments in the world.
Then, I'd go for a set of freedom businesses.
In five years, you'll be your ideal you. And yet, your ideal you will have grown to yet another level.
Good luck! (It comes with constant and fearless effort)
If it's your dream world, than you know what you need to do. But, it's going to take quite a lot from you. What are you prepared to give up to spend 5-10 hours a day figuring things out?
These guys are right and I know you don't want to hear it, but you're making excuses. I was in the same exact situation as you are now when I was 20, and my second year at school. I made small changes and did better with girls my 3rd year. Not great, but a slight improvement. And then my 4th year I lived with the right couple guys that motivated me to face it and put in more effort. I did WAY better. Still though, I did not fully embrace it. Since graduating I have.
Read Tynan's latest post on turning weaknesses into strengths and then go do it.
"I''ve given hints to hang out countless time, all have been rejected or deflected as I like to say."
Giving hints is not enough. Girls like confident guys. Ask her directly. Then you have your answer.
"Not only that, my standards are high (physically) so hitting on girls out at parties has been intimidating."
That's an excuse. If you successful hit on a girl that isn't very beautiful you don't have to have a relationship with her. It's practice. Practice will help you to develop skills.
Otherwise how about taking up a challenge for the next month:
While walking along on campus you will say "Hi" to every person you pass. Just one word. Their response doesn't matter. The thing that matters is that you are opening up to strangers by saying "Hi".
I say Hi to just about everyone I see, its not necessarily I'm antisocial, its I feel almost all my interactions are fake or disconnected or something of the sort . As for approaching beautiful women, you're right, this is an excuse, I should do it anyways no questions asked. As for I've given hints, I mean I've made it extremely obvious to the point of " I'm walking to your dorm right now lets hang out" and she flaked, making some excuse about how she wasn't there, then admitting she was 30 minutes later.
I think I understand whats keeping me so far away from women though, and its my lack of affection. I haven't given a hug to a girl in I don't know how long, its that bad haha.
The funny part is I really haven't noticed any of this until the past week when it hit me hard. But yes I try to be as social as possible, constantly saying hi and being happy. I might even begin to do my work in the library just cause I know I can be more social there.
Yeah, Honestly just think I'm going through a mini-quarter life crisis. I walked around campus today, relaxed a bit and started thinking clearer. My thinking wasn't clear and I was losing perspective. I've been literally thinking about this for the past 2 weeks or so, which has made me seem desprate as well as not genuine. I've decided to just slow down a bit relax and get back on my own track a bit and just take small steps here and there aka get more involved, say hi to more people, etc.
I'm almost never unhappy anymore, It just seems like a waste of time, I just get annoyed when things distract me and don't allow me to focus, which is what the anxieties regarding this issue were doing. I'm just going to try and relax, and keep focusing on my own life, and have the rest be a sort of byproduct/extra
The way I think about it is thinking about socializing is like thinking about running. Thinking isn't going to make you any better, only getting out there and running is.
As far as I was concerned, she was perfect. She was at least as smart as I was, was a dancer and had the body to prove it, and had a smile that could disarm the national guard. Let's call her Julie.
So, like an earthworm stalking it's prey, I put my usual game on her. Since my last flowchart was so popular, I've made another one to show you how I dealt with the ladies back then:
Nedless to say, things went slowly. We hung out nearly every day for the last couple months of our Senior year summer vacation. Like many guys, I was totally oblivious to her attraction for me. One morning Julie came over really early while I was still sleeping, and squeezed into my twin bed with me. I woke up, and assumed that she must be tired - it didn't even occur to me that she might like me. Finally on the last week of that vacation she said to me,
When I was a little girl, my favorite thing to do was draw up characters for stories that never got written. I just found them a few months ago when I was cleaning out my closet o' things at my parents. There are folders full of "Charlotte, 29, Girlfriend of Simon, brilliant, hilarious, but a little bit rude." Each character had a color scheme assigned to them. And they were always partnered or positioned to eventually be partnered up.
There's quite a bit that's problematic with the structure of those descriptions. But I want to focus in on those last parts.
I have these characteristics that I want to be (i.e. intellectual, open-minded, dependable) and I am constantly taking action in order to satisfy those characteristics.
It's a taxing way to be, I'll tell you. I've always been a thinker, an introverted rationalizer. Spending hours, days, weeks thinking through a decision or wading through a tough situation before I know how I want to understand what happened.
And people have always praised this about me. "Hannah, how responsible you are. How thoughtful. How insightful."